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PeakTrader said...
Machiavelli999, government believes it can micromanage something it doesn't understand. I have much more faith in Wall Street, which created and captured enormous real wealth in the global economy, and distributed that wealth to the masses.

The U.S. economy was better off in the 19th century before big government:

American Prosperity and Price Deflation
Written by Richard M. Ebeling
May 2008

The decades between 1865 and 1900 were the years of America’s industrial revolution. Before this time, America had an economy of primarily light industry and farming. By the beginning of the 20th century, however, the United States had surpassed all of the European nations in manufacturing, including Great Britain and Imperial Germany, the industrial giants of the time.

Mass immigration from Europe, huge capital investments, and technological improvements provided the means for America’s growth and rising standards of living that soon became the envy of the rest of the world.

During the years after 1865 prices in general slowly fell from their Civil War highs. A Consumer Price Index that stood at 100 in 1865 had declined to 57 by 1900, or a 43 percent decrease in prices over a 35 year period. On average prices went down around 1.2 percent each year over three and a half decades.

At the same time, indices of money wages in agricultural and manufacturing employment both rose during this period as labor was becoming more productive due to capital investments, even with a rising population resulting from millions of immigrants joining the American work force.

The index of money wages in agriculture rose by almost 40 percent between 1866 and 1900, while money wages in manufacturing went up 20 percent during this period. Thus, on average, money wages in general increased by about 30 percent for workers as a whole.

In combination with the productivity gains and the capital investments that resulted in the 43 percent decrease in the price level, this meant that in the last 35 years of the 19th century the real standard of living of the American people increased by almost 75 percent as measured by the positive change in the average American’s buying power in the market place.

PeakTrader said...
Machiavelli999 said: "In fact, our growth was stronger on average between 1945-1980 then it was between 1980-2009."

The U.S. could afford poor economic policies after WWII, because the rest of the world's major economies were destroyed.

We had a stable period of prosperity in the '50s and '60s. However, in the '70s, we had the worst economic period since the Great Depression. There were four recessions, in a period of accelerating inflation, from 1970-82, including two severe recessions that were worse than the recent recession.

Also, in the '50s and '60s, the U.S. didn't have millions of uneducated Third World immigrants buying new houses, new autos, etc. However, we did have that phenomenon starting in the '80s.

I give credit to the Fed for improving monetary policy, since the Great Depression. At least the Fed, unlike Congress, knows it can't micromanage a large economy without undesirable effects.

Also, you stated "like animals, our main incentive is to kill our rivals and take what is theirs."

Humans are very fragile in nature. So, our main incentive is to cooperate with other humans to survive. That cooperation has developed into a most powerful machine: The corporation.

PeakTrader said...
Stopping murders is a good reason to stop marijuana use (you know who you are).

Of course, legalizing marijuana won't stop marijuana use, like legalizing terror won't stop terrorism.

Bob, you need to deal with the world the way it is, not the way you believe it should be.

Marijuana is illegal. Alcohol is legal.

Alcohol and gambling are legal. More than 10 times more Americans use alcohol than marijuana, and more than 10 times more Americans gamble than use marijuana.

QT, second hand smoke is a good reason why marijuana should remain illegal (innocent bystanders don't get high on tobacco second hand smoke). Of course, elitists, and their families, can avoid marijuana second hand smoke living in their ivory towers.

Gambling became legal in the U.S. in 1931.

From article:

What is unique about the current gambling situation is the speed at which it has gone from an undercurrent in American society to high-profile, socially recognized activity.

Gambling statistics

Two-thirds of the adult population placed some kind of bet last year.

"Players" with household incomes under $10,000 bet nearly three times as much on lotteries as those with incomes over $50,000.

After casinos opened in Atlantic City, the total number of crimes within a thirty-mile radius increased 100 percent.

The average debt incurred by a male pathological gambler in the U.S. is between $55,000 and $90,000 (it is $15,000 for female gamblers).

The suicide rate for pathological gamblers is twenty times higher than for non-gamblers (one in five attempts suicide).

Sixty-five percent of pathological gamblers commit crimes to support their gambling habit.

QT, getting people addicted to a vice and then taxing them is not good economics, unless you're doing the taxing. A future generation may elevate legal marijuana, like gambling was elevated after legalization. I think, we have enough legal vices. I stated before, if you want to win the war on drugs, follow the Japanese model.

You'll never be able to get rid of perpetrators, but you can rehabilitate victims.

There's propaganda on both sides. However, there will always be a market for marijuana. Some people want to sell it legally, and are more than willing to pay taxes on it, while some people will buy it, for whatever reason.